Help with socket sizes

Just to reinforce what Chris says and also to mention that a 3/8" drive socket set is handiest for most jobs on the top end - a 1/2" drive 1/4w will not fit on the head fixings anyway.

King Dick still make good quality tools in whitworth sizes and as successors to Abingdon King Dick, they were once part of the R.T. Shelley group of companies alongside Norton and I belive that they're made in the UK.

Sadly 'Britool' is now the brand name used for the budget, Chinese-produced tools of the Facom group. They're not what they once were.

Have a look around autojumbles. You will often find used, old spanners which are still in perfect condition if they are quality brands. I have picked-up Gordon and old British-made Britool chrome vanadium AF and Whitworth spanners (and sockets) for less than the cost of new Chinese or Indian-madestuff.

Previously wrote:

Interesting to hear from Richard that even a time-honoured name like Britool has gone down the route to the East. Are Facom Chinese then? I have a Facom 2-legged puller stamped 'France' which is absolutely brilliant and looks very unlikely to have come from China. My 35 year old spanners are Gordon so if you can find any around, they do come recommended.

Gentlemen,

Facom is French and all the Facom tools I have purchased over the years are excellent and definately made in France. Not sure regarding "Inexpensive Chinese Facom" (or god forbid the distructiuon of the Britool brand!)

But junk shops, swap meets etc are the go and look for Footprint, Gordon, Gedore, Elora, Britool, King Dick etc. Evil Bay sometimes has some bargains too.

A slip or a broken spanner can cause mucho pain and injury, so why risk it?

Regards Steve

Previously wrote:

Interesting to hear from Richard that even a time-honoured name like Britool has gone down the route to the East. Are Facom Chinese then? I have a Facom 2-legged puller stamped 'France' which is absolutely brilliant and looks very unlikely to have come from China. My 35 year old spanners are Gordon so if you can find any around, they do come recommended.

There was an interesting documentary on tv recently. It claimed that most of the surgical instruments in the world are made in one city in Pakistan. Some of these productsmay bequestionable, but there is a caveat even with thehigh qualitystuff.

It is perfectly legal for these Pakistani companies to mark their products 'Made in Germany' for example, if the steel they are made from is German.

My understanding is that this applies to all EC (or is it EU? anyway, the Common Market) -produced raw material.

So does this mean that a spanner made in Pakistan (or anywhere else) may be legally marked 'Made in France' if the steel is French?

(Ouch, just cut myself as I opened another can of worms...)

Just because tools may be made in China does not always mean that they are inferior. Some cheap tools are quite capable of doing the job for which they were designed and if they are cheap they may not be nasty. Provided tools are used correctly and fit correctly they normally are good enough. Any knuckle skin I have lost over the years has been down to my own corner cutting or tool abuse. The people who need top quality and hence high priced tools are the professionals who are using these things day in day out. You may consider modifying a tool to achieve a result and this is always more satifying when modding a cheaper socket or spanner rather than your best Snap On. Example, I bought a socket to deal with the large fork leg top nuts on my Commando. The fit was good but the socket was deeply chamfered meaning only a small portion of the socket was contacting the nut faces. 5 minutes on the grinder and the problem was solved. The single hex impact type socket was much cheaper than the shiney chrome bi/hex item and the lack of chrome plating meant that there was nothing to subsequently flake off and compromise the fit.

Because something is broadcast on T.V, printed on paper, heard on the radio or appears on an internet forum or web site (almost forgot 'bloke down the pub said....')then it does not make it fact. Ever heard of propaganda? It was impressed on myself whilst researching for university course work never to rely on only one source of information, but to alwaysform an opinion from as many sources as possible as well asusing ones own intuition/common sense/experience. It seems to have always been the case that some people believe what they want to believe to suit therepreferences, political and otherwise.

It would appear from several messages on this forum that China and Pakistan are responsible for everything that is crap relating to Nortons, from parts not fit for purpose and now hand tools, so I agree with Dave regarding his comments on suitability, and just because something is cheap, it is probablydue to factory workers from third world countries being paid upto £2.00/hour (adopting Yorkshire accent) 'If they were lucky!' and not the actual quality. Some people automatically assumeif it is made in Britain then it is far superior to anything else, re adverts in classic motorcycling press proudly claiming parts made in Britain without any reference to tolerances, material etc. It is not far short from being jingoistic.

Judging by messages on this forum, people I have spoken to plus my own experiencesthere are still plenty of parts available from dealers not fit for purpose as well asone or two dealers whose customer and engineeringservices are rubbish. There are of course some excellent companies in Britain, but as I've said before, quality has nothing to do with geography.

Simon.

More like 2[chinese computer s got no pounds sign] a day.Ive got chinese tools Ive been using for thirty years,good stuff,if a bit roughly finished,and Im a mechanic.Some people with long memories will remember when some German tools were cheap rubbish,sockets that would loose their hex shape after one use, spanners that opened out first time. Now you trade in your Benz to buy a couple of Stahlwille spanners,theyre like precision instruments.Indian stuff has taken over the rubbish market,very easily broken,look like investment cast nodular iron,but nicely finished.

Things change,you have to move with the times. Good tools have never been cheaper,you can get together a comprehensive kit for a few dollars,not the months wages it cost in the sixties.As for the classic bike spares market,with a few notable exceptions,its definitely buyer beware.Regards John.

I was lucky enough to be left a load of BS, BSF, WHIT tools taps and dies when my father passed away, but being in the ship building and repair trade it is large sizes mainly. Some of the best spanners I have are Gedore and Elora, old but still look like new with a wipe over.

I am with simon on the quality issue, after recently having to purchase a new MAF for the car, many sellers claim genuine Bosch - made in Germany, not dodgy chinese stuff. Look close enough at the Bosch website and even they now out source manufacture to China and the like. As long as the quality control is in place it will be good enough.

Previously wrote:

Previously wrote:

Interesting to hear from Richard that even a time-honoured name like Britool has gone down the route to the East. Are Facom Chinese then? I have a Facom 2-legged puller stamped 'France' which is absolutely brilliant and looks very unlikely to have come from China. My 35 year old spanners are Gordon so if you can find any around, they do come recommended.

Ecellent advice from you all. Recommended spanners and sockets have been ordered. I will also take the advice of looking out for second hand ones.

Thankyou

Paul, Just one more tip, if you have a Commando with the LARGE nut headed sump filter you can get a 3/8 drive oil filter socket which fits it. Its a 38mm . (A socket of that size is rare and costs a packet. )

Previously wrote:

Most of the time on a Commando you will need Whitworth (BSW) spanners; the 1/4" Whitworth is the most frequently used spanner in my collection. Get a set of open enders, rings and sockets from 1/8" BSW upwards.The nut on the oil filter at the back of the oil tank measures up at 1.125" which makes it a 1.1/8" AF rather than a Whitworth. Annoyingly, it's just a shade over 5/8" BSW which has an across flats measurement of 1.100". So, you're going to need a set of AF spanners on your Commando as well.

Actually, the spanner sizes for a Commando are generally British (BS) sizes for engine and gearbox, and AF for cycle parts.