Dominator provenance?

Hiyah Derek, It sounds like your bike was re-registered in 1973 - maybe following a major rebuild or following the original registration number being sold-on. The logbook could have been lost of course after a bereavement or some such tragedy but that is quite rare. Are you sure about the engine number having seven digits ? The serial number is on the left-hand crankcase on the forward curved portion and is usually the first number made up of 5 digits. ( For instance my 1961 Dominator 99 has the number 98040 ). On the flat part of the same case will be the type number e.g. 14 or 122 for 600s and 500s respectively and up until 1960 a letter signifying the year of the engine : R=1960 N = 1958 for example. Then at the back of the left-hand case near the breather pipe is usually the Shop number (maybe four digits) and details about the bike the engine is intended e.g. 99C , 88SS etc . I note that your number ends in 8855 which makes me think that it is in fact 88SS and you are quoting the incorrect number - just a hunch and I'm sorry if that's not the case. Cheers for now, Howard

Previously derek_paul wrote:

Dear All,

I'm new to the forum so please be gentle if I inadvertently break with etiquette! I've joined as I intend to find and rebuild a Dominator 88 or 99 from around the year of my birth (1957).

I'm going to look at a Norton later this week but I don't understand the bike's provenance. Frame is Norton Dominator 88 (R122 90280) from 1960. No sign of an import but first registered on 26.07.1973 with registration WEUXXXL. Engine (600cc) number 7598855 which I can't find anywhere in Norton or Triumph archives.

Bike has been garaged since 1991 and has not been taxed or SORNed for twenty five years. It may have lost its ability to retain its 1973 number. There (may or) may not be enough old bits in it to get an age appropriate number for the frame.

Where is the engine from and any ideas about what may be going on?

Many thanks,

Derek

hello now for the yearof your machinethe date is stamp marked but its knowing were to look for it, you may need a spyglass and something to scrape paint off with, has it hiding on the very top edge of the top lug for the engine steady just at the back side of the headstock its stamped in very small numbers and a letter D for dominator like my 1954 model88 its say D/4/54 so this now indicates this machinewas built in april1954, and yours should be something like, this D/10/59 has new machnie were built from september 1959 for 1960 and will be stamped with an R 122 -90xxx witch would have come out in red and dove grey for a de-lux model or green and dove grey for a standard model, thire was the odd black and dove grey but this colour was primary for the model 50. 350cc single, the Es2 model received Green and dove grey or now landrover ardent off-white and forest green. and your engine number is fictitious and should the same as the frame number. yoursanna j Dixon Archive!

I'd try and get the existing owner to make the necessary changes. I would not want to run the risk of losing its registration etc etc. and ending up on a Q plate and maybe paying full tax. (Does anyone truly understand the rules nowadays?)

I have access to a prewar bike with one wrong digit on V5 and simply don't know what to do about it. Probably nothing...the plate is worth more than the bike and I don't want to run the risk of losing that.

If you do change one number easily, could you please let us (me) know how it went? Maybe then I shall be brave and try it myself.

In theory you should provide a receipt for the engine or insurance inspection report but an exception was made for historic vehicles, although I canât see it on their website, I did find this post on another forum from 2014.

TooTallMike said:Last time I did this I just entered the new info on the V5 and sent it in for amendment. Has something changed?

- MG

Apparently so Mike, you now have to provide a receipt for the engine if you change fuel types, but I've just found this which says Historic vehicles are given an easier time, maybe that's why yours wasn't questioned.

The February newsletter of the FBHVC announced the DVLA change of policy for Historic Vehicle engine changes and anticipated that there may be difficulties:

"Verification of Engine changes.

This was a subject that has been causing some difficulties. DVLA have now made a statement as follows:

âI note that the issue of evidence to support notifications of engine change also features [in the list of questions]. As you are aware, this was raised at the recent meeting with the Minister. I am pleased to confirm that this policy has been reviewed and that it will no longer be necessary for keepers of vehicles in the Historic class - date of manufacture before 1 Jan 1973 - to provide evidence to support an engine notification. Grateful if you can pass this information on to your membersâ.

All credit must go to David Hurley and Geoff Smith of the Federation for being able to do promote a âtop downâ approach to resolve this problem.It is anticipated that DVLA will need time to brief their staff of this change in policy, and update their internal and external documentation.

In the unlikely event that an engine change for a vehicle with the taxation class of Historic Vehicle is rejected by DVLA, please send a copy of the rejection letter to the Federation. This should enable the Federation to have the rejection letter retracted, and enable DVLA to re-brief the staff member who sent out the rejection letter. If it is a âverbalâ rejection, then the name of the DVLA staff member and the name of the office will be helpful."

The Federation Secretary is Rosy Pugh, Stonewold, Berrick Salome, Wallingford, Oxfordshire. OX10 6JR

The Ariel Arrow I had last year had had its engine changed by a previous owner but the V5C still showed the original (Arrows had the same engine and frame numbers and both were on a plate pop riveted to the "frame").

I just sent in the V5C with the correct engine number and it was returned corrected with no comments. This would have been late last year.

Previously derek_paul wrote:

David and Dan,

Thank you for your comments. I think my first action should be to sound out the DVLA about the wrong engine number as the correct number is in keeping with the vehicle. If that works out, given a now correct engine number from 1958 and bike from 1960 should I then be able to apply for an appropriate 1960 registration? The bike is basically original (frame, forks, wheels, tanks, lights, steering and probably gearbox). The present reg number is from 1973.

Cheers,

Derek

Hello Now to prove your frame and motorcycle was built for 1960 you need to photo the top lug next to the head stock to do this you must scrape off all paint from the top edge to revele the small stamp marks for the date of manafactuer witch will state D/1/60 or D/12/59 and once photoed you can make a copy and send of the original,,,,, The Regisiation is from the Frame or chassis and not the engine,

yours anna j Dixon