great ride out last week, starting and charging well [thanks to Tony Cooper and A.O.]
But he ride was spoilt by the clutch....worked fine to start with then gradually got more difficult to change gear, finding neutral was horrendous.
all apart now and cannot find anything wrong.
5 plain plates and 4 friction plates total 1.146 inches
any clues as to what I am doing wrong?
Check that the operating lever is tight on the scroll and hasn't slipped round.
Is the primary chain overtightened? Can happen if not finally pushed forward when adjusting.
I wouldn't suspect the actual clutch itself especially not in a short ride.
we did about 120 miles [over some Lakeland passes]
the primary chain is o.k., operating lever has not slipped
lever is not catching on gearbox housing
clutch main nut is tight and has not moved
no burrs on clutch centre
there is no circlip around the clutch body......would that make a difference?
all plates nice and flat
It seems your clutch probably got too hot going up those passes (Kirkstone?) and the plain plates distorted and took up the free play. These plates don't distort in a buckle or wave shape, but convex like a saucer. If you go on the RGM website catalogue and look at the Manx plain plates you will see they have radial slots cut halfway through the plate from the inside edge. These end in a small hole which stops the plate fracturing, and these slots absorb the convex distortion, and hopefully maintain the correct adjustment. If there is enough room in the basket at full lift, you don't really need the circlip and it is better to have room to spare rather that try and fit too many plates.
thanks Richard and Ian
I've put it back together and will try again this week,
We went over Corney fell and Honister so nice easy runs, went over Wrynose and Hardnott the week before and it coped well.
I've ordered a couple of pawl springs from S.R. M as I think the one fitted is a bit weak
will give an update
Good luck John....
all apart again, I think the clutch centre nut has come loose again.....what is the best way of keeping it in place? locking nut?
Worth trying a serated washer behind the nut?
Although not shown in the pics the spares books notes a main axle nut (aka clutch retaining nut) and a locking washer part nos. A2/372 and A2/373 respectively. I had the same problem and the solution was to do it up really tight. A loosening nut would give the symptoms you describe.
... which seems to keep the whole lot together. One of those thick single coil jobs.
The clutch on your ES2 is a slightly different design to the later AMC type in that the chain-wheel basket is solid on the AMC while the earlier type has Ferodo inserts. When these get worn and squashed on the sides where they fit in the chain-wheel and also the rollers which it runs on become worn, allows the basket to be wobbled when the clutch centre is tight, as there is only the inserts to keep it firmly in position. This shouldn't be a problem, unless the inserts start breaking up.
the clutch inserts look o.k. thanks Richard
went out again yesterday,120 miles,
still a problem, I had to resort to stopping the engine at traffic lights, putting it in neutral [by hand] and restarting when the lights turned green.
what a faff!
a friend has suggested that it is clutch slip that is causing the heat, and another has suggested A.T.F. in the chaincase
the saga continues
Had my Manx out on racetrack this weekend. First time since 1995. The nut with serrated washer was torqued to the recommended 40 ft.lbs ( 54 Nm ). It came loose. Tightened it until I tasted blood in my mouth. Worked well after that.
On clutch springs. There are stronger and lighter ones available. Only time so far that I've got wrong parts from Andover.
Hi again John,
The trick, although not always possible, is to try and select neutral before you come to a stand-still as the movement from the rear wheel will help engage the gears. With modern traffic conditions you might not have chance to do this at every occasion, but give it a try. Still think the plates are the problem.
Let us know the answer when you find it, John. It seems to be a fairly common problem and certainly one I've had. Mine was the centre nut but yours may be a different prob.
good run out today, managed to find neutral a couple of times.
gave it lots[about1/4 inch] of free movement on pushrod.
replaced pawl spring on return although it looked o.k. video is of the bog chain method of tensioning kick start spring
, very poor quality but you get the drift!
Norton laydown kickstart spring