1954 ES2 Rear Mudguard

Hi Albert,

If you are looking to replace like for like then you are in for a very long search as the originals are extremely rare almost never turning up secondhand.

They have been remade in India these are ofinferior quality and look wrong even at a distance. The radius is wrong and inconsistent, profile isn't quite right and a door hinge is used instead of the proper item.

Reality is that if you want to keep it original the only way is to repair rather than replace.

Jim

I would have suggested a wideline rear mudguard as these are not far off the mark for a 57 pre F/bed single.

Trouble is that you can't even get one of those now.

Will someone get a grip of this spares situation and take responsibility? We need solutions, not excuses!

Doesn't Fred Williams do wideline rear 'guards?

Previously albert_pisani wrote:

Thanks to all for the pointers. I am in Malta though, so would need to go through normal channels. I don't know who Fred Williams is, or have his contact details.

A

Hi Albert, Fred Williams, Repro Wideline Parts, only has a phone number 01234 824117. He's here in UK. I haven't contacted him in a while but I got mudguard stays and other bits made by him. Maybe worth a call.

Adam

Interesting, when I bought my front slimline mudguard for my 1960 99 (With the V at the front) less than two years ago, Fred told me that he only makes front mudguards. All credit to the club spares for supplying me with an excellent British made rear mudguard for that.

I'll have to give Fred a call to see if he is making rear ones now as well. Good news if he is.

It is usually the case that a batch could be made if someone would only loan a good original, but of course they hardly ever do, so what can we expect. Joe S at Andover told me that most of the factory drawings for pre Commando stuff ended up in a skip. (Not by him I must add) Otherwise these could be made from the drawings.

Remember: Failure is when you give up!

Previously Neil Wyatt wrote:

I would have suggested a wideline rear mudguard as these are not far off the mark for a 57 pre F/bed single.

Trouble is that you can't even get one of those now.

Will someone get a grip of this spares situation and take responsibility? We need solutions, not excuses!

The 54/55 andmay be 56are different to the 57, I have a 54-55 model7 and a 57 ES2, the 54/55 guard is wider with a hinge and narrows at the point where the shock bolts pass thru the alloy spacer into the guard, the 57/58 ES2 & wideline guardhas the samewidth [parallel] sides and is narrower in section than the earlier guard

Previously Neil Wyatt wrote:

I would have suggested a wideline rear mudguard as these are not far off the mark for a 57 pre F/bed single.

Trouble is that you can't even get one of those now.

Will someone get a grip of this spares situation and take responsibility? We need solutions, not excuses!

The 54/55 andmay be 56are different to the 57, I have a 54-55 model7 and a 57 ES2, the 54/55 guard is wider with a hinge and narrows at the point where the shock bolts pass thru the alloy spacer into the guard, the 57/58 ES2 & wideline guardhas the samewidth [parallel] sides and is narrower in section than the earlier guard

http://www.hitchcocksmotorcycles.com/accessory-frame-mudguards

The 1950's rear guard looks fairly similar:...The hinge part could be created by chopping and TIG welding.:

lES

Another source (cheaper) and almost certainly by the same Indian manufacturer....Note the extra photos of it at the bottom of the advert.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/REAR-MUDGUARD-HANDMADE-ROYAL-ENFIELD-EARLY-1950s-/140791911222?hash=item20c7da1336:m:mI0RN9ADzWXiG4fIjisj2XA

Les

Hi Albert

I had a similar problem locating one for my single Down-tube 1953 Model 7 which has I believe the same or very similar rear mudguard. I ended up using a late 50 Matchless one which is constructed in a very similar way. I had to do some work on it to get it looking correct but I found it a good alternative. They seem to be easier to get hold of then the near impossible to find Norton ones. If you want a picture of the finished article let me know. I didn't fit a hinge to it but no reason why one could nor be fitted if someone wanted to. It looks and fits great.

Paul G (Kent & Surrey Branch)

I may be able to help, so long as you don't turn your nose up at composite plastic replicas! A NOC friend has made a mould from my 1955 ES2 rear mudguard and has made a marvellous copy of it using modern plastic materials, with suitable reinforcement. It is so good that you don't need to paint it as it is a really glossy black finish.

As it is for a solo motorcycle I've had it made so that the hinge is copied, but does not open; on a solo you can get the back wheel out without lifting the tail section, but with a sidecar fitted the hinged section is invaluable.

The other point of interest is that there are two styles of rear mudguard fitted to these mid 50's models. Mine is a 'D' section with vertical sides, whereas I've seen more models with a 'C' section and a flared end to the tail section. I don't know whether this difference was just using up spares but I've owned my ES2 since 1970 and that was what was fitted to the machine when it was only 15 years old. Every hole and bracket fits perfectly, so it was not a sourced from another machine.

The cost of these will be about £80 to £100 if I can persuade my friend to make more, and it won't be done in a hurry! I can take a couple of photos if you're interested.

Also, I still have a rear mudguard that is available for copying by the spares scheme if they want a pattern. This is also the 'D' section version. I know how difficult these mudguards are to find as I've only ever seen one for sale in the last 35 years, and I bought this for my model 7 project!

Philip Ham

If this helps I bought a 1957 wideline original rear mudguard for my 1955 88 wideline and whilst I appreciate there are differences for the purist with a bit of tweaking with the top mounting spacers I would suggest it more than serves the purpose. This was purchased in A1 condition from a regular bike jumble participant at Kempton park but was a "one off" at extortionate price. The club do a pattern one at half that I paid so must be worth a try.

Regards, Roger

Are you telling me the club have these back in stock, Roger?

Previously albert_pisani wrote:

Previously philip_ham wrote:

I may be able to help, so long as you don't turn your nose up at composite plastic replicas! A NOC friend has made a mould from my 1955 ES2 rear mudguard and has made a marvellous copy of it using modern plastic materials, with suitable reinforcement. It is so good that you don't need to paint it as it is a really glossy black finish.

As it is for a solo motorcycle I've had it made so that the hinge is copied, but does not open; on a solo you can get the back wheel out without lifting the tail section, but with a sidecar fitted the hinged section is invaluable.

The other point of interest is that there are two styles of rear mudguard fitted to these mid 50's models. Mine is a 'D' section with vertical sides, whereas I've seen more models with a 'C' section and a flared end to the tail section. I don't know whether this difference was just using up spares but I've owned my ES2 since 1970 and that was what was fitted to the machine when it was only 15 years old. Every hole and bracket fits perfectly, so it was not a sourced from another machine.

The cost of these will be about £80 to £100 if I can persuade my friend to make more, and it won't be done in a hurry! I can take a couple of photos if you're interested.

Also, I still have a rear mudguard that is available for copying by the spares scheme if they want a pattern. This is also the 'D' section version. I know how difficult these mudguards are to find as I've only ever seen one for sale in the last 35 years, and I bought this for my model 7 project!

Philip Ham

Hi Philip,

Yes I am interested so would like to see a photo if possible. I cannot wait very long though as I am away on the bike by mid August and will return home first week in September. But once I'm back I could look into replacing it again.

Thanks,

A

Albert,

I'm having diffculty attaching a photo to this comment. Will try again this evening.

Philip

Phillip,

That's a BSA (possibly Panther?)style mudguard you have there not a Norton one. The only difference between a 53-54 and a 55 rear mudguardare the hole positions.

Pic attached of a genuine 55 rear mudguard for comparison.

Jim

Previously philip_ham wrote:

Previously albert_pisani wrote:

Previously philip_ham wrote:

I may be able to help, so long as you don't turn your nose up at composite plastic replicas! A NOC friend has made a mould from my 1955 ES2 rear mudguard and has made a marvellous copy of it using modern plastic materials, with suitable reinforcement. It is so good that you don't need to paint it as it is a really glossy black finish.

As it is for a solo motorcycle I've had it made so that the hinge is copied, but does not open; on a solo you can get the back wheel out without lifting the tail section, but with a sidecar fitted the hinged section is invaluable.

The other point of interest is that there are two styles of rear mudguard fitted to these mid 50's models. Mine is a 'D' section with vertical sides, whereas I've seen more models with a 'C' section and a flared end to the tail section. I don't know whether this difference was just using up spares but I've owned my ES2 since 1970 and that was what was fitted to the machine when it was only 15 years old. Every hole and bracket fits perfectly, so it was not a sourced from another machine.

The cost of these will be about £80 to £100 if I can persuade my friend to make more, and it won't be done in a hurry! I can take a couple of photos if you're interested.

Also, I still have a rear mudguard that is available for copying by the spares scheme if they want a pattern. This is also the 'D' section version. I know how difficult these mudguards are to find as I've only ever seen one for sale in the last 35 years, and I bought this for my model 7 project!

Philip Ham

Hi Philip,

Yes I am interested so would like to see a photo if possible. I cannot wait very long though as I am away on the bike by mid August and will return home first week in September. But once I'm back I could look into replacing it again.

Thanks,

A

Albert,

I'm having diffculty attaching a photo to this comment. Will try again this evening.

Philip

Albert,

At long last I've made contact with my friend who made this replica plastic mudguard and must apologise for getting your hopes up. He made this mudguard and other Norton replicas and advertised them, but no-one showed any interest in buying them. So recently he discarded all of his moulds and stopped this little sideline, what a shame.

The only possibility now is for the Club to have another batch made as these are just so difficult to obtain.

Regards

Philip

Previously jim_royce wrote:

Phillip,

That's a BSA (possibly Panther?)style mudguard you have there not a Norton one. The only difference between a 53-54 and a 55 rear mudguardare the hole positions.

Pic attached of a genuine 55 rear mudguard for comparison.

Jim

Jim,

I know you think this is not a correct mudguard for my 1955 ES2, but I can assure you that it is not a BSA or Panther mudguard. When you go to NOC events or other gatherings of motorcycles take special note of these rear mudguards; I've been studying them since I realised mine was different from others i.e. about 40 years ago! I've seen at least 4 others identical to mine, and they fit perfectly with all of the holes and number plate fittings.

As I've owned my ES2 since 1970 and it was only 15 years old at the time, it is most likely to be the original fitment. Other people jump to the same conclusion as you and say it's wrong, well I beg to differ.

Philip

Phillip,

Sorry but your mudguard is nothing like the catalogue image of any 55 model while the mudguard I have posted a picture of is identical. My M7 which this mudguard is from is confirmed all original tinware by several people.

The pushrod singles (not including the 19R)used the same tinware bar the petrol tank.

You aren't the only one to have researched tinware variation and though catalogue images are often wrong the 55 images are very, very close to reality.

Jim