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Gearbox oil

Submitted by dave_young on Tue, 12/05/2015
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Have realised my gearbox oil is low on my Norton model 50 350 1957 - I have some Titan ATF3000 oil in my garage, would this be ok or could anybody suggest a more suitable oil?

Submitted by neil_wyatt on Tue, 12/05/2015

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Previously Dave Young wrote:

Have realised my gearbox oil is low on my Norton model 50 350 1957 - I have some Titan ATF3000 oil in my garage, would this be ok or could anybody suggest a more suitable oil?

NO, this is made for automatic transmissions and also OK in your Commando Primary chain case.

Ideally use Castrol EP 90 GL4 that does not contain the harmful additivesdetrimental to yellow metal. Alternatively, you could use Miller's 80/90 gear oil. Other brands are available but make sure it is not GL 1 or 2. Engine oil is better than ATF and suggested in some manuals.

Charles B knows a lot about oil and it would be interesting to see what he says.

PS: Let me know if you have a spare set of engine plates, PLEASE!

Submitted by ian_richtsteig on Wed, 13/05/2015

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Previously Dave Young wrote:

Have realised my gearbox oil is low on my Norton model 50 350 1957 - I have some Titan ATF3000 oil in my garage, would this be ok or could anybody suggest a more suitable oil?

Without wanting to start another thread on oils, engine oil is perfectly satisfactory for your gearbox. I use Penrite HPR 50 in all of my post 1932 gearboxes.

Submitted by neil_wyatt on Wed, 13/05/2015

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Yes Ian, as said, Engine oil such as the thicker SAE 50 is acceptable, indeed it was recommended for my ex WD 16H, though these days I use gear oil 140 to reduce leakes.

But gear oil is called gear oil for a reason, hence I wanted to hear the comments of Charles B. As I said, engine oil is better than ATF, roughly the equivalent of SAE20. Happy riding.

Submitted by john_holmes on Wed, 13/05/2015

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There is no need to avoid GL5 and use GL4, early versions of GL5 attacked bronze/brass bushes at 100C and above (ref Glacier Bearing Design Handbook) but within a few years of the GL5 introduction the chemicals that caused the issue were subsitituted for safe alternatives and for the last few decades GL5 oils are safe for use in Norton Gearboxes, I have been using GL5 in my Commando gearbox for 30 odd years and only issue has been the layshaft ball bearing.

If you want to read some more

http://www.benzworld.org/forums/unimog/1358944-gl4-vs-gl5-gear-oil-plot.html

Submitted by nigel_hall on Wed, 13/05/2015

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Previously Dave Young wrote:

Have realised my gearbox oil is low on my Norton model 50 350 1957 - I have some Titan ATF3000 oil in my garage, would this be ok or could anybody suggest a more suitable oil?

Hi Dave,I also think that the Titan may be a bit light for the application and may allow noise from the gears to be more prominent. I have a car with a 6 speed manual gearbox and 550 hp running on an ATF and this works fine.Its also true that you could use an engine oil but the choice of a product with the correct level of anti-wear additives would be sensible. I would look for a Diesel engine oil to API CI4 with around 100 to 150 cSt. Something like Petro-Canada Duron Synthetic 5W-40 works well. We have it running in an Aprillia Mille and it works well in my Harley Sportster. Gear oils (automotive ones) tend to be based on Sulphur Phosphorous chemistry and have around a 2% additive treat for GL4 and 4% for GL5. The GL5 products are intended for use in Hypoid bevel axles in cars and trucks whereas the GL4 products are generally intended for use in gearboxes and less severe axle applications.I use a multi-grade industrial gearbox oil in both my Mk111 Commando and F1, it has around a 1.8% additive treat and is 150 cSt at 40C. For the technically minded it is a group 3 and 2 blend and is highly stable with a VI of about 183. This equates to around SAE40. I think the use of the old EP 90 (if you can find one) and EP 140 are unnecessarily heavy causing viscous drag and in-turn preventing reliable tick-over in cold weather. The multigrade also works well at higher temperatures where it resists thinning.I could go on for years on this subject (Its my job) but would be happy to try to suggest suitable modern lubricants for the bikes we run and love. Just because its an old bike it doesn't mean we have to use old lubricants.Nigel Hall

 


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