SWINGING ARM LUBRICATION

Hi Stuart. As far as I know EP oils are thought to damage yelow metal bearings and bushes such as phosphor bronze. It is the phosphor additive within the oil that attacks the copper I think.

As the swingarm is not subject to extreme pressures there is no need for an EP oil anyway just a thick standard mineral 140 SAE grade.

This type of oil can still be found as Castrol D or Hi Pessand I have seen a good quality 140 grade oil on Ebay for Seagull outboard motor engines for their gearbox.

Hope this helps.

Les H

Eg:

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Castrol-Classic-2370-EP140-GEAR-OIL-1Litre-SAE-Hipress-/400089772897?cmd=ViewItem&pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_CarParts_SM&hash=item5d27357361

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/British-Seagull-Outboard-Engine-Gear-box-OIL-SAE-140-/370182846271?cmd=ViewItem&pt=UK_CarsParts_Vehicles_Boat_Engines_EngineParts_SM&hash=item56309df73f

LesH

OH DEAR....SORRY....forget the CASTROL HIPRESS....seems as if that is ALSO an EP Type!

Stickto Castrol D:

http://www.holden.co.uk/displayProductsByBrand.asp?brand=Castrol%20Oil&brandCode=Y3

OR any straight mineral type such as the Seagull gearbox oil.

Les H

Sorry to come back a fourth time but I've just noticed the Holden webshop display for the Castrol D oil reads:

"Use in vintage cars provided that there are no bronze or brass bushes present"

Take no notice. They have made an obvious mistake with this and this note should show with the Castrol HipressEP 140 oil they also sell.

Seeing this just now, I am reminded that I emiled them to let them know of this error some time back....but guess what?...they never bothered to reply and they are still showing the WRONG info...ha ha ha!

How common is that with so many on-line suppliers. I have to say that this is one thing that does annoy me quite a bit. You take the time and trouble to help someone and they just ignore it and go on showing their mistake.

It also reminds me of another Motorcycle board that I write in, so many people ask for help...you give it, or someone else does, and the person asking the question never comes back to acknowledge thecontributers thatgave theman answer, so one never finds out if they ever did resolve the problem or if the help was any good. Very impolite IMHO.

Sorry for diverging from the oil question.

ATB

Les H

If you please, Les H. et al

Wonderingif this pertains to the Commando swingarm bushes. Are they not the same material? The Norton workshop manual has the swingarms being lubricated every 6000 miles with BP SAE 90 EP gear oil, Texaco Multigear Lubricant EP 140, Shell Spirax 90 EP and other non EP but similar viscosity oils.

Not meant to argue your point, only for continued discussion.

Regards,

Steven Phelps

In reply to Steven Phelps, thanks for coming up with that detail. The bearings could use similar metals and I note the oil recommendation.

I wonder if the fact of yellow metal corrosion by EP oils is something of a fairly recent discovery, by that I mean after the late 70's?

Everywhere I have checked on the web seems to show stories that EP oil pits bronze bearings.

I have seen this damage for myself so the fears are backed up with personal experience.

The straight 140 SAE oil plays safe, so that is what I would choose.

EP lubricants have sulphur and phospherous additives that attach to the surface molecules of the steel and act as a barrier when steel surface slide over each other under extreme pressure as in hypoid diiffs and gearbox's.

That type of action is not present in a swing arm bearing so an EP type oil is not required anyway, just thick oil to give normal lubrication and thick enough to stop it running straight out.

Regards

Les H

Previously wrote:

In reply to Steven Phelps, thanks for coming up with that detail. The bearings could use similar metals and I note the oil recommendation.

I wonder if the fact of yellow metal corrosion by EP oils is something of a fairly recent discovery, by that I mean after the late 70's?

Everywhere I have checked on the web seems to show stories that EP oil pits bronze bearings.

I have seen this damage for myself so the fears are backed up with personal experience.

The straight 140 SAE oil plays safe, so that is what I would choose.

EP lubricants have sulphur and phospherous additives that attach to the surface molecules of the steel and act as a barrier when steel surface slide over each other under extreme pressure as in hypoid diiffs and gearbox's.

That type of action is not present in a swing arm bearing so an EP type oil is not required anyway, just thick oil to give normal lubrication and thick enough to stop it running straight out.

Regards

Les H

Les,

I agree with your assessment and will use the non EP oil in swingarms, many Commando swingarms"survive" without any lubrication because of theZerk fitting and owners not reading the maintenance schedule correctly...

Hi Ron Corbin. It would be nice to hear all you know about GL4 typeoil. I detect a bit of sarcasm in your post, and I was just thinking what a helpful bloke you were. I'm sure you could benefit most of us with your clariifcation even if it ispasting on the web entry you have found or the link to it. I'd be very thankful to read it.

Cheers.

Les