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Alton eKit for belt drive

Submitted by rob_bradley on Fri, 27/02/2015
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Commando

The state of my knees and hips due to advancing age has made me decide to convert my Mk IIA to electric start. I assumed it would be a simple case of buying an Alton kit and installing it but it's turning out to be more complicated.

For a start the two UK suppliers I've approached, Hawkshaws and Andover Norton, are out of stock and waiting for delayed supplies from Alton, who I get the impression are struggling to keep up with demand.

Secondly, I have a Steve Maney (30mm) belt drive. Hawkshaws have never heard of it and say Hayward belt drives are the only ones they know suit the Alton kit. Apparently it depends on the diameter of the clutch drum, for one thing. Andover Norton told me to contact Alton to find out what spacers I'd need to suit my set up.

I emailed Alton a week ago but have had no reply. I was starting to think this looks like a company that has gone bust but Hawkshaws assure me they are still in business, just too busy to answer emails. I suppose my next step will have to be to try and telephone Alton, but I thought I'd ask here first in case anyone has anything helpful to offer, or even experience of fitting an Alton kit with a Maney belt drive. I can easily supply whatever measurements are relevant, but if Alton are the only people who know and they won't communicate, I'm a bit stuck.

Submitted by john_holmes on Fri, 27/02/2015

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Alton do seem to be too busy and can't keep with demand, lots of supply issues and a couple of design issues which they have sorted. I am still not sure if I will go that route, CNW will be releasing their electric start add on later this year but it will come with a belt drive so yours would need to be taken off and sold on ebay. CNW are saying it will cost less than the Alton, if they drive it off the back of the clutch they will save on the alternator and chains etc.

Submitted by rob_bradley on Fri, 27/02/2015

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Previously john_holmes wrote:

Alton do seem to be too busy and can't keep with demand, lots of supply issues and a couple of design issues which they have sorted. I am still not sure if I will go that route, CNW will be releasing their electric start add on later this year but it will come with a belt drive so yours would need to be taken off and sold on ebay. CNW are saying it will cost less than the Alton, if they drive it off the back of the clutch they will save on the alternator and chains etc.

Is there any information out there about the CNW kit? I can't see anything on their website.

Submitted by john_holmes on Fri, 27/02/2015

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This is the first announcement that there will be a new electric start conversion for the pre MkIII Commandos available this year.cNw has teamed up with Special Tool Solutions out of Jacksonville, FL to design and manufacture a brand new starter conversion for the kick start Commandos.

Submitted by rob_bradley on Sat, 28/02/2015

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Thanks John. Those pages make interesting reading. Hobot reminds me of someone who pops up in many of the posts on this forum!

It seems that if I want to keep a dry belt drive it might be wise to avoid a starter with a sprag clutch, something I wasn't aware of.

Since I can't get an Alton anyway, I might be better off waiting in the hope that CNW's version isn't too delayed or too expensive, and may be better engineered. I get the impression you're thinking along the same lines?

Submitted by mark_woodward on Sun, 01/03/2015

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I have a 1974 850Mk.IIA which has a RGM belt drive and three years ago decided to fit an Alton e-start. At that time suppliers (Norvil etc.) stated that the system suitable for belt drives were 'on their way'. I managed to contact Alton at the time and ordered their system which was claimed 'will fit all belt drive systems'. I doubted this as I know that belt drives have subtle differences. Alton contacted me and stated that they would not supply me directly as the belt drive system was in the 'beta' phase and they wanted a professional to fit it. They authorised the Motorcycle Restoration Company in Saffron Walden to fit it. I duly transported the bike to them and it transpired that it took them about three days to fit it as it needed 'tweaks' etc. The biggest issue with the MkIIA is that the battery tray is the wrong shape and orientation for the larger battery required due to the original plastic air filter housing. The Motorcycle Restoration Company made a good job of the fitment and the final result is an excellent enhancement to the bike. I notice now however that Alton seem to have stopped advertising the belt-drive version of the e-start. I suspect that this may be due to the difficulties in producing a 'universal' system.

Mark Woodward

Submitted by john_holmes on Sun, 01/03/2015

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"Since I can't get an Alton anyway, I might be better off waiting in the hope that CNW's version isn't too delayed or too expensive, and may be better engineered. I get the impression you're thinking along the same lines?"

Yes I am waiting on the CNW, the other alternative is to mount a ring gear on the back of the clutch and use a Harley Davison starter mounted on the modified gearbox plates, I have pics of this setup on a Commando and a Vincent which used a belt drive. The ring gear is a std geartooth form and can be made easily by a gear maker. You can use a belt drive with this and run the setup dry as there are no chains or sprag gears. Downside is the need for fixed centres so a belt tensioner will be needed.

Attachments CaferacerSeptNov2009%20001.jpg

Submitted by tony_harris on Wed, 04/03/2015

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Although I have not had my March RH yet I think there should be an artical of the starter motor I fitted to my Commando Dommi using the gear on the back of the clutch method.

Tony

Submitted by john_holmes on Wed, 04/03/2015

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Yes it has an article from Tony Harris who also did a Vincent conversion, its the same type of setup as the photo in my post. If you go on the OldBritts website they do a similar setup too but as sold by them is very pricey. If you have access to a milling machine and lathe is not difficult once you have the ring gear made for you.

Submitted by rob_bradley on Thu, 05/03/2015

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Alton did eventually reply. Apparently Steve Maney refused to help them with dimensions to set up an Alton starter with his belt drive. I don't know whether this implies he was thinking of developing his own electric start, or whether he doesn't want an Alton starter to be used with his belt drive for some reason. Maybe it's a safety issue: http://www.accessnorton.com/mk3-belt-drive-suggestions-t20091.html suggests sprag clutches will seize if run dry, though CNW suggest a particular bearing in the Mk3 starter is the main problem.

I'm now in a quandary. I can get a kit direct from Alton if I'm prepared to make a suitable spacer, but should I risk running a sprag clutch dry?

By the way, when I last looked at the Old Brits website they had stopped making the electric start conversion.

 


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