First Manxman

Hi Mike.......I.D. numbers as follows are general and not tablets of stone.

 Norton Dominator - Top Yokes

Wideline                     -  19019  or  L122/174

Slimline                      -  030027                                  

Sidecar                      -  030402 or 21593

 Crown & Stem 

Wideline                     -  50259

Slimline                      -  030026

Sidecar                       -  030340  or 21508

It looks to me like the tope yoke (Head Clip) does match the numbers in this table. You may need to remove a little more paint to discover the one on the lower yoke (Crown & Stem)

Attachments show variations of serial stamping positions.

Hi Mike

I watch your U/Tube videos they are great.

I have ridden a 1961 Norton Manxman for the last 10 years.

Pictures of my Manxman can be seen at "The Gathering Of The Nortons" at Washington        Crossing PA.

Thanks for your interest in the Manxman.

  Geoff Craig

Hi Philip, Sounds like you have a lot of good information on these bikes.  I am rebuilding a Manxman as well.  I believe mine was built on the same day as Mikes.  I have VIN  93617 on the engine and frame. on the back side, below the left cylinder I have a 20 stamped below the 65.  My gear box is number 20103.  Ive read that there were about 30 built on the first day. 

-Pete 

Hi Peter.......your numbers match my records. As follows are the other numbers as listed.

Job Number - 15670 

Engine - 93617                           

Engine Shop Number - 20                   

Gearbox  - 20103             

Dispatch Date - 07/11/60         

Destination  - Tozer Berliner USA 

Of interest is the Job No which is 18 before that of Mike's bike. Was your bike built before Mike's but did not receive its engine until later? The story goes that the first two production lines of Manxman 650 bikes were held up while engine issues were sorted. There is also evidence suggesting that two bikes were completed and used for road testing the month before full production actually began. That these two machines were given later ID's and then slotted into a later shipment.

Your bike and Mike's headed out of the Bracebridge gate along with 16 other 650 Manxmans. But 28 others had preceded this, including the two test bikes. All of these machines along with another 100 plus were transported up to Liverpool before  shipping over the pond to the States in early January. A second equally large consignment followed at the end of that month.

Some of the second consignment were re-routed to the US West Coast ,Canada and Europe. By the time 280 bikes had been produced they were being shipped all over the world but not the UK. From February onwards a good number of 650 machines headed to Europe but dressed-up in the style of the later 650SS. In essence they were standard 99 frames with 650 twin carb engines in them. Some had Blue tanks but many were all Black.

It is interesting to learn little bits of history here and there.  I am not a collector, I restore and customize bikes for a living, but if there is any way I can hold on to this one, I will.  If it didn't have original paint on the frame I would think differently about keeping it.  The fuel tank, oil tank, and tool box are solid as a rock but repainted and rough.  If I can find  decent original painted parts, I am going to build an aluminum manx tank and make it look the part.  Im having a lot of fun with this resurrection so far.  Here is her current state: 

In response to  Anna Jeannette Dixon on Sun, 07/07/2019

Hello Anna,

I just chanced upon this fascinating discussion about a bike I knew nothing about.

But I have to pick up your throw-away comment that "the EU are doing there(sic) best to get [cellulose paint] banned here too". It is my view that casually blaming the EU for something we don't like is at least partly to blame for the mess we find ourselves in at the moment. So here are the facts.

Solvent-based, so called 'cellulose', paints are subject to various restrictions around the world because of legitimate concerns about the release of volatile organic compounds into the atmosphere. In the UK, use of such products in vehicle repair, refurbishment and customising is covered by the Paint and Products Directive (PPD). Basically, this means solvent-based paints cannot be used. This is regulated at the European level so that rules are harmonised across the EU Internal Market (Single Market); otherwise a bodyshop in Armagh (NI) complying with the regulations would be at a disadvantage if one 10 miles away in Monaghan (ROI) did not.

However, the following categories are not affected by the PPD: Agricultural vehicles; Trains & Trams; Snow mobiles and Motor bikes. For the amusing reason that they are not categorised as "motor vehicles". So we can carry on using 'cellulose' to paint our petrol tanks.

Any paint finish you might want is available in a water-based version but, as you'll be well aware, they are impractical for us back street restorers.

It's quite possible that solvent-based paints will be banned outright at some point but it will be because 7 billion people decide that they can no longer use the planet as a dustbin. And that will happen regardless of whether the UK is part of the EU.

Very enlightening Stan, thank you.

Regards

Dick

hello  now what you have put I all already know all about this since I have been using cellulose paints for the last forty years  and do restoration over this times  cars and bikes and the odd Ford Transit van  and if used in the right way  with filters on the fan extractor and use the right protective clothing ECT and an HPV gravity feed mini spray guns  so this keeps the after spray to a minimum  yours OK and have never had any problems with it,    And one more thing  Guys Just because MY NAME IS  ANNA  Dose no mean I am some blond bimbo that knows nothing about  motorcycle restorations or engineering   I Have been an owner of Nortons and other motorcycles for the last 50 years and Have been a chief engineer on some of the biggest ship afloat . and just rebuilt my 650 Manxman motor yet again and if I do not like a thing I will do it all again until its right,  and I make my own parts at times As I do have an Atlas ten-inch swing over bed Lathe  witch is a 1935 model but in perfect condition  in time I am converting it to CAD operation, and I have my own paint booth    and welding equipment MIG /TIG ARC SIF equipment,   So now you can all stop being biased against me,  please,    Yours  Anna j